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bmsgOn June 24, 2023, SKY-HI was invited on to TV Tokyo's Economy News Academy to share his thoughts on the state of Jpop and the J-entertainment industry.
As per his wishes (which you will read under the cut!), the interview - all 55 minutes of it! - is available on TV Tokyo Business's YouTube channel.
One month later, the video has 1.4 million views!
Video link here
You're welcome to read the transcript as you follow along!
Note: Some parts on the transcription are paraphrased / summarized by me, other parts are direct quotes from SKY-HI. I had a system going and then didn't follow through, lmao. Sorry.
Translated byshizuna, some help with context and notes from connie44
Two sources of pressure:
No bank loans, pulled through the first six months of the company (the most difficult period) because of B-Town (Architects & Residents)
“Rather than the money I have, I had to be aware of what I was spending the money on. Thankfully BE:FIRST during their auditions, THE FIRST, garnered a lot of attention and were successful, so recouping [the 100 million yen] was fast.”
The 100 million yen was pretty much his savings.
Context: The total expenses of THE FIRST was actually 140 million yen, which he brought up when he was on Da-iCE music lab.
Host: You took a lot of risk then..
SKY-HI: I didn’t think of it as a “risk”
He was sometimes apologetic, “Sorry, if I had more money I’d take you guys to eat something better.”
Has been in this business for 18 years, (as member of dance+vocal group, AAA, as an underground rapper, etc)
“There are obviously others more talented and skilled than me in the industry, but I became aware that I was best suited for this job while I was a rapper. I had to work with all the existing [Japanese] major labels for features, events, and work with them in order to cross over from one genre to another... indies, major, various types of major...rock, hip hop, idol, dance music, so my database is more than just a database!”
For dome(s) – It depends on staging and how much is in the budget for stage(s) and that can shift the cost from single-digit billion yen to double-digit billion yen
Some things that affect this: moveable stage, the number of smaller / runwalk stage(s), other items or backdrops on stage, etc.
Usually people say an audience of 50,000 for a dome concert, but there are people who perform with just 30,000. Similar to Budokan, they often say 10,000 people for a Budokan performance but it’s possible to perform at Budokan with just 5000 people
“‘Because after that, you’re known as “an artist who performed at Budokan’”
“Strangely, Japan’s stagnant economic state is reflected [in Japanese entertainment]”
In Thailand, you can hold an arena concert that costs around 20,000 yen and sell tickets at a price of 10,000 or so yen
In Japan, the equipment and technology is constantly evolving and world-renowned, but the cheapest tickets are around 20,000 to 30,000 yen. With the economy not being great, tickets these days charge around 17~18,000 yen, but a lot of live performances are not taking advantage of that technology and its potential.
Context: Basically, the Japanese entertainment industry is currently operating under a low profit margin, meaning they are not selling their goods (CDs) much higher than what it costs to make them
Ticket sales has not changed compared to 20 years ago
“Basically, I feel that the state of the entertainment industry is like this due to the economic downturn. I truly feel that, because if the economy isn’t getting better, entertainment industry isn’t able to grow, and if the entertainment industry doesn’t grow, the economy suffers”
From his book, Management no Hanashi” (p. 11): “The business model of the Japanese entertainment industry hasn’t changed in the past 30 years. Can the industry survive…”
He does not think the Japanese entertainment industry can survive.
Case: NiziU. Members are all Japanese and were trained in Japan, however, management label is S.Korea (JYP)
Japanese talents are choosing to debut in S.Korea instead of Japan in order to become a global star
“There are a lot of boys who want to be a world star too, but think, ‘I can’t do that with a Japanese company, but I might be able to do so with a S.Korean company.’ If it doesn’t work out in S.Korea, they go ‘Well, I guess I’ll debut in a Japanese company 🤷’, there are a lot of these people around, and growing by the day.”
“Actually, debuting in Japan was never their goal in the first place. I was aware there might be a lot [of boys like this]. Once I did THE FIRST, I was saying, ‘See!? Isn’t there a lot?!’”
Host: This is a structural problem isn’t it?
SKY-HI: it really is. If you look up Japanese entertainment corporations, it’s definitely because one entertainment company made too great a success in the 80s to early 2000s. The magnitude of that success means management and music labels could not update itself from how it operated 20 years ago. Around the 2010s things really changed for S.Korea
“It’s truly all connected. Selling CDs was always the goal [for the Japanese music industry], so CDs were always copy controlled, right? That way you couldn’t import the music onto your computer. Then around the 2010s, artists worldwide were uploading MVs on to YouTube. But for some reason, Japan was uploading ‘Youtube version’ or ‘Youtube short’, never the full MV”
Host: Do you think it was because they were scared [MV or music] will be copied? Did they think there was a sense of danger?
SKY-HI: More like this idea of advertising [MV] for a product [CD] did not exist.
Host: Ah, so other countries around the world were doing this but Japan was thinking, this isn’t how we do it, we can’t just show the product to them.
SKY-HI: Exactly, “I’m selling these things for advertising, you shouldn’t just look at it.”, that line of thinking has somehow stayed... Now it has become “The Internet is scary”. Even in the year 2023, it’s hard.
Host: So the world and S.Korea are moving on and it seems Japan is in a box of their own.
SKY-HI: Correct. Artists from Thailand.. Well, Taiwan, Thailand, Indonesia, Malaysia, Singapore, Philippines – there are a lot of global stars emerging from these countries. There’s playlists right, Malaysian artists will make it into an “Asia something something” playlist or you see them on YouTube…. There are artists like that in Japan too, but Japan has strayed too far away from everyone else. Japan’s “music program” is based on the system of the industry in the 80s, the dynamics in the industry is built on those power relations.
It’s not that Japan isn’t birthing global stars, there are definitely a lot and are active. But because it’s different from Japan’s rules and manners, there are a lot of difficulties.
He thinks the relationship between a management company and its talents is too master-servant.
You often hear “The office will scold me!”, you’re not a business partner and rather than an employer-employee relationship it’s very master-servant. When you hear people say “the office will scold me”, it can feel catastrophic – the producer doesn’t like you; you have less work.. It feels like this has been going on for way too long?
From Management no Hanashi (p. 112): “Charts in the first half of the 2010s were skewed”
Quote from former CEO of Nintendo: “To stir up the spirit of competition and risk-taking, business models that generate temporary sales are damaging in the long-run because they do not win trust”
SKY-HI: It is damaging, [what he said] was very cool.
He understands the appeal of buying a CD for its goods: a person who put their heart & soul into the song; the artwork; the extra goods. He is collector himself (he collects analogs)
But it becomes problematic when you’re buying 3-4 CDs that you won’t listen to just to show your support. It’s not sustainable (SDGs).
Context: Here, boss is referring to UN's sustainable development goals (SDGs).
Due to bulk-buying, it’s been hard to see change in the industry and this has delayed the systematic turnaround needed for things to improve
“The global music market is on the right track, only Japan’s market is declining”
“‘But we’ve been doing business this way since the 80s’!' I get a lot of that.”
Budget for CDs stalls the development of the music industry
It’s built on the assumption that CDs have a certain level of impact: Popularity of artist → budget for CD sales → what remains = budget for MVs. Thus, budget for music videos is based on [projected / predicted] CD sales
[The artist] has a lot of talent, but [record labels] aren’t able to spend their budget on MVs.
Sales of CD is on the decline because some labels are raising the price, the market itself is slowly getting smaller and smaller; the actual decline should be a lot sharper
“In this era, there are many [artists / talents] who end up not being well known in the world because they weren’t able to shoot MVs that were well-made.”
Streaming platforms are popular these days, and the Japanese music industry seems to be heading in a much healthier direction because of that.
Billboard Japan is a well-rounded chart and he strategizes based on that, because the chart properly captures multiple angles: CD sales, streaming, download, Youtube, etc. and a balance for each quarter
Based on who is releasing, he may drop the goal for CD sales if another idol group is doing a release, or if there are a lot of streaming campaigns going on, he will drop the goal for streaming in order to have a healthy chart
SKY-HI checks Billboard Japan frequently
“I sometimes hear of bought view counts for YouTube. Of course, you can increase the views naturally by sharing it, but you can also increase the views just by clicking on it. I’ve heard about that. Sometimes I’d be like “Eh? These boys are doing that well?” with a 30 million view count, but then there aren’t a lot of likes and comments.”
“I think it’s possible to pad / buy the number of views, or the “likes” or "comments", so I try to look at it from multiple angles. How many listeners do you have per month on Spotify? And try to gauge popularity from that.”
Q: How do songs get selected onto those playlists?
SKY-HI: Communication used to be listener-artist and artist-market, the artist looks at the market and says, “Well, this is what the market is asking for, isn’t it?” or “Well, everyone seems to be in the mood for this, then… You hit the mark!” If not, then “What was different? Maybe I’ll do it this way this summer” Right now it’s pretty divided. 20 years ago, whatever GLAY-san or SMAP released, everyone knows it. What is similar to that right now are the editors of the DSP playlists.
If they aim for this playlist, maybe this artist will have a new future open to them
Aiming at a specific point, for how many months… anyone can make contact [with playlist editors] although [artists are] coming in huge numbers.
We create the content for the pitch first, I add a lot of hashtags. “It’s a song like this, it has these instruments in it, this kind of genre that fits a particular time” this indicates where you want to be in a playlist. Even then, you don’t know whether you’ll make it into these playlists or not. You don’t get to meet these playlist editors.
Host: So these playlist editors have considerable power?
SKY-HI: I wouldn’t put it like that, [if songs make it onto playlists] it simply means the communication [with playlist editors] was successful.
Host: So making it onto the playlists is your goal, with the hashtags..
SKY-HI: Yes, other than hashtags, we also prepare long English pitches.
Host: So you prepare a media kit that includes the pitch and hashtags and send it to DSPs
SKY-HI: Yes, we’re intentional about it.
SKY-HI: With BE:FIRST, they made their debut in November, 2021. I definitely wanted their Spotify listeners to reach 1 million pretty quickly. I thought, “what did I need to get there? [I needed] constant releases; and if I could, have them make it onto big playlists.” Definitely these two, and we succeeded.
20 years ago, the industry worked by strategy and politics. Now, I’d say it’s probably impulse and authenticity
In the past, music and entertainment worked together. Currently, whether for good or bad, they’re separated now.
“When the demand leans towards an artist’s charm and responsiveness rather than their vocal+dance, if that is what they like doing, they will progress further. At some point, we’ve come to accept that this is what the industry is, and has led it to become a fan service industry.”
Whether you call them “artists” or “idol” it doesn’t matter, but when you ask, “what do you call someone who performs on stage as their job?” You answer, “someone who makes music, and sing and dance” But if you think about it that way, it means improving the quality of the music, the quality of the MVs, the quality of the choreography, the quality of the vocals – to do that we train. A simple blueprint was created, Kpop was already doing it.
SKY-HI: You often hear people say, “with idols, it’s not their skills or abilities.”
Host: It’s their charm and talking
SKY-HI: Yes. With fan service, it gets you focused on how to talk and how to serve fans, and it’s been successful for a long time. I think that’s a stumbling block for growth.
There are definitely people who become an idol or artist because they like them. If you like music and think you can become a professional, you probably still have a vision of what you want to be as a professional artist, don't you? Yet there's not enough time for singing and dancing to reach that goal. So... naturally, there are things that need to be done and things that don't need to be done.
I think at this point in time, people can tell whether an artist or idol is doing what they want to do or not, so it’s a good time for us to show the world what we’re doing, that’s why I started BMSG. Be myself – I want to do things the way I want to do them – is BMSG, to be as you are. This philosophy is very strong.
The goal has always been the global market from the beginning
“I think it’s quite significant that it’s no longer that big of a deal”
With the Internet, for example, it is possible for friends in Brazil to see this video at this very moment. Or I say that I’ll release a new song next month. The moment it drops, friends in America listen to it too. We’re living in an era where all of this is possible.
So naturally, it has become a goal. I don’t think it’s too difficult to achieve, that’s one side of this.
On the more negative side, I’ve been complaining about this since the mid-2010s. I have been saying, "If we don't look outside of Japan, the music industry won't have a future!” But when I make such statements or it’s in the news and I say something, I am often under fire. I get people telling me, “Why bother going global? Doing well in Japan is enough.” or “You get famous, do well, and get paid well in Japan, isn’t that enough? Mind your own business.”
But that’s where they’re wrong, the global market is only going to get bigger, while Japan’s market is only going to become smaller and smaller.
The [Japanese] population is decreasing, so what will happen then? The number of kids – people – who want to become musicians is declining, the competition is decreasing, and the quality [of music] is declining.
Of course, the music industry isn’t just made up of artists. If the music industry itself is not thriving, talented people who want to work in the music industry will stop coming. In the end, people will gather where there is prosperity, excitement, energy, and activity.
The music industry is slowly caving in on itself, and about 60% of the market is already closed.
Host: Is there an overseas sales ratio at BMSG?
SKY-HI: I guess I’m wondering whether it would be better to tell you or not
Host: It’s hard to say?
SKY-HI: Yes, it’s hard to say. More like, it’s difficult because selling artists overseas, or IP (intellectual property), people think it’s necessary to put it out there as such (“Overseas Challenge!”), or actually move overseas to do so, in the past that is. That is no longer the case, it’s now possible to become a world star while living in Japan and only knowing Japanese.
If you say that you are 75% here, the number of people in Japan will be about a quarter of that. However, the population of SEA is so large that even if you combine the population of Japan and S.Korea, you still can't beat the population of Indonesia that are under the age of 29. And considering the economic growth, I am sure that SEA will become the main battleground.
Ignoring this [overseas market] is… Hmm… to put this in a way people in Japan understand, it’s like saying, “I’ve been active and doing activities in Akita Prefecture! I’ve filled up the best live houses in Akita pretty well! Oh… but.. Tokyo is scary, so I’m not going there.” – that’s been the mentality of Japan for the past 20 years.
Host: So you’re aiming for the world’s highest peak of entertainment – the Half-Time Show at the [NFL] Super Bowl?
SKY-HI: Yes.
Host; Will you go eventually?
SKY-HI: I would love to. I can imagine how fun it’ll be for us, as Japanese people, to be there.
SKY-HI: With Coachella, there are already Asian artists being invited. Like Perfume and Kyary Pamyu Pamyu.
The success of KPOP artists is truly a blessing to us, because it has become natural for Asians to be number one in American showbiz, the American entertainment world. It gives us hope and dream [to get there] as Japanese people.
It was imagined but now concrete with [BE:FIRST] out there, they often discuss, “What roadmap do we need to get there?” We talk about it together a lot.
I’m nothing but full of hopes and dreams for the industry right now.
I think the ideal state for artists and idols is, there is no difference between their on and off-time. We’re in an era where we see things and receive information 24 hours a day. Speaking for myself, I’m not all that different from when I was meeting you (the host) and when I was in my dressing room. I think it would be better if artists can be like that
XG is the exact opposite of BMSG, in a good way.
In a world that is saturated with KPOP's well-crafted music, XG is determined to make it even better and do something cool. I watched their documentary, they’re very disciplined and always striving to do more. I used to do sports so it was very cool for me. I watch BE:FIRST’s documentary after XG’s, and they’re just having fun in their dressing room… 😂
It’s interesting as far as ideological differences go. A lot to work on.
SKY-HI: Also, XG’s producer, Simon, is around the same age as me and a former idol like myself
Host: So, it’s like a battle between the same generation?
SKY-HI: Can you not frame it as a battle, please?
Context: SKY-HI does not like it when people pit him / BMSG / his boys against others in the industry. He believes that the world is big enough for everyone
Host: SKY-HI, you’re in a suit today, isn’t that pretty rare?
It’s a customized suit
“I try to dress as casually as possible these days, but with BMSG and with the success of BE:FIRST I’m talking with more and more people. To not put pressure on them, I’ll try to dress casually.”
Thought he’ll dress a little formally to put pressure onto the audience watching, especially on entertainment in the business scene.
“Entertainment in the business scene is in the midst of a revolution. It’s a place where the biggest opportunities are not taken yet, so I want to appeal to them”
“Entertainment is the ultimate B2C (business to consumer)”
Context: B2C (business to consumer) is a process of selling products and services directly between a business and consumers who are the end-users of its products or services.
The numbers for engagement and reach is, and can be, huge
If the business side doesn't get excited, in other words, if the world doesn't become a place where a lot of money circulates, it will have a negative impact on the entertainment industry.
If we don't do our best in entertainment, we will fall further and further behind as a nation
We need to spend a lot of money on camera work, video technology, and other kinds of technologies, and we need to make more and more money for entertainment.
The interrelationship is really strong, so I would like to appeal to that... somehow.
Entertainment turns the economy around, and I want people to use entertainment more to turn the economy around. I wanted to appeal to that strong tie at any cost.
From Management no Hanashi (p. 152): The world's top choreographers have high guarantees, about the same as KPOP's budget sense, sometimes 4-5 times, or even almost 10 times, that of regular Japanese groups.
The fees for individual choreographers are totally different, but in S.Korea, you have to go through competitions, and you can already get a certain amount of money when you are one of the competing groups.
Whether you’re a group that won #1 at a world dance competition, they go “We’ll pay you this much, can you choreograph this part for us?” and they’ll only use the dance for one verse, or just the intro, something like that. Even if you’re dropped (from competing) or your choreography is not used, they’ll still pay you. That’s why he thinks their budget is 10 times that of Japan, (Fees: ~1 million yen for 1 class || Japan: ~hundred thousand yen)
It’s easy for Kpop to offer 10 million yen and divide it into 1 million yen each (for each choreographer) for 10 different parts of a song. I can’t imagine the practice time for such a feat though.
Host: Those are impossible numbers for Japan?
SKY-HI: Even 5 million yen for choreography seems a bit of a reach even for Japan, don’t you think?
Please note I translate these for free, so they may not be super perfect.
Retranslations or sharing of the summaries is fine! For retranslations, please notify me beforehand and credit once posted!
As per his wishes (which you will read under the cut!), the interview - all 55 minutes of it! - is available on TV Tokyo Business's YouTube channel.
One month later, the video has 1.4 million views!
Video link here
You're welcome to read the transcript as you follow along!
Note: Some parts on the transcription are paraphrased / summarized by me, other parts are direct quotes from SKY-HI. I had a system going and then didn't follow through, lmao. Sorry.
Translated by
shizuna, some help with context and notes from connie44On being a CEO
Two sources of pressure:
- “The artists under BMSG have a strong sense of trust [with the company] so.. I really want to repay them for that. Right now, it’s absolutely essential that I am trusted by my artists and they feel happy that they trust me. So that’s the biggest stress”
- “The other pressure is, I’m the head of everything, whether it’s them or the company, they’re all my responsibility.”
On bank loans
No bank loans, pulled through the first six months of the company (the most difficult period) because of B-Town (Architects & Residents)
On THE FIRST
“Rather than the money I have, I had to be aware of what I was spending the money on. Thankfully BE:FIRST during their auditions, THE FIRST, garnered a lot of attention and were successful, so recouping [the 100 million yen] was fast.”
The 100 million yen was pretty much his savings.
Context: The total expenses of THE FIRST was actually 140 million yen, which he brought up when he was on Da-iCE music lab.
Host: You took a lot of risk then..
SKY-HI: I didn’t think of it as a “risk”
He was sometimes apologetic, “Sorry, if I had more money I’d take you guys to eat something better.”
SKY-HI & His Perception of Japanese Entertainment
Has been in this business for 18 years, (as member of dance+vocal group, AAA, as an underground rapper, etc)
“There are obviously others more talented and skilled than me in the industry, but I became aware that I was best suited for this job while I was a rapper. I had to work with all the existing [Japanese] major labels for features, events, and work with them in order to cross over from one genre to another... indies, major, various types of major...rock, hip hop, idol, dance music, so my database is more than just a database!”
SKY-HI on ticket pricing & profit
For dome(s) – It depends on staging and how much is in the budget for stage(s) and that can shift the cost from single-digit billion yen to double-digit billion yen
Some things that affect this: moveable stage, the number of smaller / runwalk stage(s), other items or backdrops on stage, etc.
Usually people say an audience of 50,000 for a dome concert, but there are people who perform with just 30,000. Similar to Budokan, they often say 10,000 people for a Budokan performance but it’s possible to perform at Budokan with just 5000 people
“‘Because after that, you’re known as “an artist who performed at Budokan’”
“Strangely, Japan’s stagnant economic state is reflected [in Japanese entertainment]”
In Thailand, you can hold an arena concert that costs around 20,000 yen and sell tickets at a price of 10,000 or so yen
In Japan, the equipment and technology is constantly evolving and world-renowned, but the cheapest tickets are around 20,000 to 30,000 yen. With the economy not being great, tickets these days charge around 17~18,000 yen, but a lot of live performances are not taking advantage of that technology and its potential.
Context: Basically, the Japanese entertainment industry is currently operating under a low profit margin, meaning they are not selling their goods (CDs) much higher than what it costs to make them
Ticket sales has not changed compared to 20 years ago
“Basically, I feel that the state of the entertainment industry is like this due to the economic downturn. I truly feel that, because if the economy isn’t getting better, entertainment industry isn’t able to grow, and if the entertainment industry doesn’t grow, the economy suffers”
On BMSG, the company
- Employee count currently at 40
- No vice president so far
- Once the company hits 50 or more, he thinks he may need more supervision
- Wanted to implement a business hierarchy when the company was at 30 employees
- Business hierarchy: a term used to describe the organizational structure of a company. This includes the different levels of employment from entry-level employees, mid-level employees, mid-level managers senior managers and executives like the CEO.
On the precarious situation of the Japanese Entertainment Industry
From his book, Management no Hanashi” (p. 11): “The business model of the Japanese entertainment industry hasn’t changed in the past 30 years. Can the industry survive…”
He does not think the Japanese entertainment industry can survive.
Case: NiziU. Members are all Japanese and were trained in Japan, however, management label is S.Korea (JYP)
Japanese talents are choosing to debut in S.Korea instead of Japan in order to become a global star
“There are a lot of boys who want to be a world star too, but think, ‘I can’t do that with a Japanese company, but I might be able to do so with a S.Korean company.’ If it doesn’t work out in S.Korea, they go ‘Well, I guess I’ll debut in a Japanese company 🤷’, there are a lot of these people around, and growing by the day.”
“Actually, debuting in Japan was never their goal in the first place. I was aware there might be a lot [of boys like this]. Once I did THE FIRST, I was saying, ‘See!? Isn’t there a lot?!’”
Host: This is a structural problem isn’t it?
SKY-HI: it really is. If you look up Japanese entertainment corporations, it’s definitely because one entertainment company made too great a success in the 80s to early 2000s. The magnitude of that success means management and music labels could not update itself from how it operated 20 years ago. Around the 2010s things really changed for S.Korea
On Japan Uploading “Youtube version” MVs
“It’s truly all connected. Selling CDs was always the goal [for the Japanese music industry], so CDs were always copy controlled, right? That way you couldn’t import the music onto your computer. Then around the 2010s, artists worldwide were uploading MVs on to YouTube. But for some reason, Japan was uploading ‘Youtube version’ or ‘Youtube short’, never the full MV”
Host: Do you think it was because they were scared [MV or music] will be copied? Did they think there was a sense of danger?
SKY-HI: More like this idea of advertising [MV] for a product [CD] did not exist.
Host: Ah, so other countries around the world were doing this but Japan was thinking, this isn’t how we do it, we can’t just show the product to them.
SKY-HI: Exactly, “I’m selling these things for advertising, you shouldn’t just look at it.”, that line of thinking has somehow stayed... Now it has become “The Internet is scary”. Even in the year 2023, it’s hard.
Host: So the world and S.Korea are moving on and it seems Japan is in a box of their own.
SKY-HI: Correct. Artists from Thailand.. Well, Taiwan, Thailand, Indonesia, Malaysia, Singapore, Philippines – there are a lot of global stars emerging from these countries. There’s playlists right, Malaysian artists will make it into an “Asia something something” playlist or you see them on YouTube…. There are artists like that in Japan too, but Japan has strayed too far away from everyone else. Japan’s “music program” is based on the system of the industry in the 80s, the dynamics in the industry is built on those power relations.
It’s not that Japan isn’t birthing global stars, there are definitely a lot and are active. But because it’s different from Japan’s rules and manners, there are a lot of difficulties.
On Management-Talent Relationship
He thinks the relationship between a management company and its talents is too master-servant.
You often hear “The office will scold me!”, you’re not a business partner and rather than an employer-employee relationship it’s very master-servant. When you hear people say “the office will scold me”, it can feel catastrophic – the producer doesn’t like you; you have less work.. It feels like this has been going on for way too long?
On Music Charts
From Management no Hanashi (p. 112): “Charts in the first half of the 2010s were skewed”
Quote from former CEO of Nintendo: “To stir up the spirit of competition and risk-taking, business models that generate temporary sales are damaging in the long-run because they do not win trust”
SKY-HI: It is damaging, [what he said] was very cool.
He understands the appeal of buying a CD for its goods: a person who put their heart & soul into the song; the artwork; the extra goods. He is collector himself (he collects analogs)
But it becomes problematic when you’re buying 3-4 CDs that you won’t listen to just to show your support. It’s not sustainable (SDGs).
Context: Here, boss is referring to UN's sustainable development goals (SDGs).
On Bulk-buying
Due to bulk-buying, it’s been hard to see change in the industry and this has delayed the systematic turnaround needed for things to improve
“The global music market is on the right track, only Japan’s market is declining”
“‘But we’ve been doing business this way since the 80s’!' I get a lot of that.”
On Budget for CDs and MVs
Budget for CDs stalls the development of the music industry
It’s built on the assumption that CDs have a certain level of impact: Popularity of artist → budget for CD sales → what remains = budget for MVs. Thus, budget for music videos is based on [projected / predicted] CD sales
[The artist] has a lot of talent, but [record labels] aren’t able to spend their budget on MVs.
Sales of CD is on the decline because some labels are raising the price, the market itself is slowly getting smaller and smaller; the actual decline should be a lot sharper
“In this era, there are many [artists / talents] who end up not being well known in the world because they weren’t able to shoot MVs that were well-made.”
On Streaming & the Billboard Japan Chart
Streaming platforms are popular these days, and the Japanese music industry seems to be heading in a much healthier direction because of that.
Billboard Japan is a well-rounded chart and he strategizes based on that, because the chart properly captures multiple angles: CD sales, streaming, download, Youtube, etc. and a balance for each quarter
Based on who is releasing, he may drop the goal for CD sales if another idol group is doing a release, or if there are a lot of streaming campaigns going on, he will drop the goal for streaming in order to have a healthy chart
SKY-HI checks Billboard Japan frequently
On YT videos with bought views
“I sometimes hear of bought view counts for YouTube. Of course, you can increase the views naturally by sharing it, but you can also increase the views just by clicking on it. I’ve heard about that. Sometimes I’d be like “Eh? These boys are doing that well?” with a 30 million view count, but then there aren’t a lot of likes and comments.”
“I think it’s possible to pad / buy the number of views, or the “likes” or "comments", so I try to look at it from multiple angles. How many listeners do you have per month on Spotify? And try to gauge popularity from that.”
On DSPs (Digital Service Provider)
Q: How do songs get selected onto those playlists?
SKY-HI: Communication used to be listener-artist and artist-market, the artist looks at the market and says, “Well, this is what the market is asking for, isn’t it?” or “Well, everyone seems to be in the mood for this, then… You hit the mark!” If not, then “What was different? Maybe I’ll do it this way this summer” Right now it’s pretty divided. 20 years ago, whatever GLAY-san or SMAP released, everyone knows it. What is similar to that right now are the editors of the DSP playlists.
If they aim for this playlist, maybe this artist will have a new future open to them
Aiming at a specific point, for how many months… anyone can make contact [with playlist editors] although [artists are] coming in huge numbers.
We create the content for the pitch first, I add a lot of hashtags. “It’s a song like this, it has these instruments in it, this kind of genre that fits a particular time” this indicates where you want to be in a playlist. Even then, you don’t know whether you’ll make it into these playlists or not. You don’t get to meet these playlist editors.
Host: So these playlist editors have considerable power?
SKY-HI: I wouldn’t put it like that, [if songs make it onto playlists] it simply means the communication [with playlist editors] was successful.
Host: So making it onto the playlists is your goal, with the hashtags..
SKY-HI: Yes, other than hashtags, we also prepare long English pitches.
Host: So you prepare a media kit that includes the pitch and hashtags and send it to DSPs
SKY-HI: Yes, we’re intentional about it.
SKY-HI: With BE:FIRST, they made their debut in November, 2021. I definitely wanted their Spotify listeners to reach 1 million pretty quickly. I thought, “what did I need to get there? [I needed] constant releases; and if I could, have them make it onto big playlists.” Definitely these two, and we succeeded.
20 years ago, the industry worked by strategy and politics. Now, I’d say it’s probably impulse and authenticity
In the past, music and entertainment worked together. Currently, whether for good or bad, they’re separated now.
What is BMSG?
“When the demand leans towards an artist’s charm and responsiveness rather than their vocal+dance, if that is what they like doing, they will progress further. At some point, we’ve come to accept that this is what the industry is, and has led it to become a fan service industry.”
Whether you call them “artists” or “idol” it doesn’t matter, but when you ask, “what do you call someone who performs on stage as their job?” You answer, “someone who makes music, and sing and dance” But if you think about it that way, it means improving the quality of the music, the quality of the MVs, the quality of the choreography, the quality of the vocals – to do that we train. A simple blueprint was created, Kpop was already doing it.
SKY-HI: You often hear people say, “with idols, it’s not their skills or abilities.”
Host: It’s their charm and talking
SKY-HI: Yes. With fan service, it gets you focused on how to talk and how to serve fans, and it’s been successful for a long time. I think that’s a stumbling block for growth.
There are definitely people who become an idol or artist because they like them. If you like music and think you can become a professional, you probably still have a vision of what you want to be as a professional artist, don't you? Yet there's not enough time for singing and dancing to reach that goal. So... naturally, there are things that need to be done and things that don't need to be done.
I think at this point in time, people can tell whether an artist or idol is doing what they want to do or not, so it’s a good time for us to show the world what we’re doing, that’s why I started BMSG. Be myself – I want to do things the way I want to do them – is BMSG, to be as you are. This philosophy is very strong.
BMSG & the World
The goal has always been the global market from the beginning
“I think it’s quite significant that it’s no longer that big of a deal”
With the Internet, for example, it is possible for friends in Brazil to see this video at this very moment. Or I say that I’ll release a new song next month. The moment it drops, friends in America listen to it too. We’re living in an era where all of this is possible.
So naturally, it has become a goal. I don’t think it’s too difficult to achieve, that’s one side of this.
On the more negative side, I’ve been complaining about this since the mid-2010s. I have been saying, "If we don't look outside of Japan, the music industry won't have a future!” But when I make such statements or it’s in the news and I say something, I am often under fire. I get people telling me, “Why bother going global? Doing well in Japan is enough.” or “You get famous, do well, and get paid well in Japan, isn’t that enough? Mind your own business.”
But that’s where they’re wrong, the global market is only going to get bigger, while Japan’s market is only going to become smaller and smaller.
The [Japanese] population is decreasing, so what will happen then? The number of kids – people – who want to become musicians is declining, the competition is decreasing, and the quality [of music] is declining.
Of course, the music industry isn’t just made up of artists. If the music industry itself is not thriving, talented people who want to work in the music industry will stop coming. In the end, people will gather where there is prosperity, excitement, energy, and activity.
The music industry is slowly caving in on itself, and about 60% of the market is already closed.
Host: Is there an overseas sales ratio at BMSG?
SKY-HI: I guess I’m wondering whether it would be better to tell you or not
Host: It’s hard to say?
SKY-HI: Yes, it’s hard to say. More like, it’s difficult because selling artists overseas, or IP (intellectual property), people think it’s necessary to put it out there as such (“Overseas Challenge!”), or actually move overseas to do so, in the past that is. That is no longer the case, it’s now possible to become a world star while living in Japan and only knowing Japanese.
If you say that you are 75% here, the number of people in Japan will be about a quarter of that. However, the population of SEA is so large that even if you combine the population of Japan and S.Korea, you still can't beat the population of Indonesia that are under the age of 29. And considering the economic growth, I am sure that SEA will become the main battleground.
Ignoring this [overseas market] is… Hmm… to put this in a way people in Japan understand, it’s like saying, “I’ve been active and doing activities in Akita Prefecture! I’ve filled up the best live houses in Akita pretty well! Oh… but.. Tokyo is scary, so I’m not going there.” – that’s been the mentality of Japan for the past 20 years.
Host: So you’re aiming for the world’s highest peak of entertainment – the Half-Time Show at the [NFL] Super Bowl?
SKY-HI: Yes.
Host; Will you go eventually?
SKY-HI: I would love to. I can imagine how fun it’ll be for us, as Japanese people, to be there.
SKY-HI: With Coachella, there are already Asian artists being invited. Like Perfume and Kyary Pamyu Pamyu.
The success of KPOP artists is truly a blessing to us, because it has become natural for Asians to be number one in American showbiz, the American entertainment world. It gives us hope and dream [to get there] as Japanese people.
It was imagined but now concrete with [BE:FIRST] out there, they often discuss, “What roadmap do we need to get there?” We talk about it together a lot.
I’m nothing but full of hopes and dreams for the industry right now.
No on or off-state; being transparent
I think the ideal state for artists and idols is, there is no difference between their on and off-time. We’re in an era where we see things and receive information 24 hours a day. Speaking for myself, I’m not all that different from when I was meeting you (the host) and when I was in my dressing room. I think it would be better if artists can be like that
On XG
XG is the exact opposite of BMSG, in a good way.
In a world that is saturated with KPOP's well-crafted music, XG is determined to make it even better and do something cool. I watched their documentary, they’re very disciplined and always striving to do more. I used to do sports so it was very cool for me. I watch BE:FIRST’s documentary after XG’s, and they’re just having fun in their dressing room… 😂
It’s interesting as far as ideological differences go. A lot to work on.
SKY-HI: Also, XG’s producer, Simon, is around the same age as me and a former idol like myself
Host: So, it’s like a battle between the same generation?
SKY-HI: Can you not frame it as a battle, please?
Context: SKY-HI does not like it when people pit him / BMSG / his boys against others in the industry. He believes that the world is big enough for everyone
Appealing to Businesses & Economists
Host: SKY-HI, you’re in a suit today, isn’t that pretty rare?
It’s a customized suit
“I try to dress as casually as possible these days, but with BMSG and with the success of BE:FIRST I’m talking with more and more people. To not put pressure on them, I’ll try to dress casually.”
Thought he’ll dress a little formally to put pressure onto the audience watching, especially on entertainment in the business scene.
“Entertainment in the business scene is in the midst of a revolution. It’s a place where the biggest opportunities are not taken yet, so I want to appeal to them”
“Entertainment is the ultimate B2C (business to consumer)”
Context: B2C (business to consumer) is a process of selling products and services directly between a business and consumers who are the end-users of its products or services.
The numbers for engagement and reach is, and can be, huge
If the business side doesn't get excited, in other words, if the world doesn't become a place where a lot of money circulates, it will have a negative impact on the entertainment industry.
If we don't do our best in entertainment, we will fall further and further behind as a nation
We need to spend a lot of money on camera work, video technology, and other kinds of technologies, and we need to make more and more money for entertainment.
The interrelationship is really strong, so I would like to appeal to that... somehow.
Entertainment turns the economy around, and I want people to use entertainment more to turn the economy around. I wanted to appeal to that strong tie at any cost.
On Kpop choreography
From Management no Hanashi (p. 152): The world's top choreographers have high guarantees, about the same as KPOP's budget sense, sometimes 4-5 times, or even almost 10 times, that of regular Japanese groups.
The fees for individual choreographers are totally different, but in S.Korea, you have to go through competitions, and you can already get a certain amount of money when you are one of the competing groups.
Whether you’re a group that won #1 at a world dance competition, they go “We’ll pay you this much, can you choreograph this part for us?” and they’ll only use the dance for one verse, or just the intro, something like that. Even if you’re dropped (from competing) or your choreography is not used, they’ll still pay you. That’s why he thinks their budget is 10 times that of Japan, (Fees: ~1 million yen for 1 class || Japan: ~hundred thousand yen)
It’s easy for Kpop to offer 10 million yen and divide it into 1 million yen each (for each choreographer) for 10 different parts of a song. I can’t imagine the practice time for such a feat though.
Host: Those are impossible numbers for Japan?
SKY-HI: Even 5 million yen for choreography seems a bit of a reach even for Japan, don’t you think?
Please note I translate these for free, so they may not be super perfect.
Retranslations or sharing of the summaries is fine! For retranslations, please notify me beforehand and credit once posted!
